Here is a little advance peek at the Estates and Baronial economics.
As it stands now anyway
there is more explanation, but this is the "accounting part"

Improve Personnel
To increase total income, each of the offices must be filled with a suitable candidate. If a more suitable candidate is substituted, the overall efficiency is increased. The table nearby shows the duties that are necessary for the barony to operate. Some require a certain type of social class or rank, and in others certain skills, are more important.
If they are filled properly, then the barony takes in its annual total income. This minimalist attitude is based on two things:
1. Baronies are large enough to allow a shortage in one place to be made up by an excess in another; and
2. The Household is, at its heart, a bureaucracy.

Like all bureaucracies, the medieval bureaucracy does not rely upon efficiency. Its functionaries are mediocre, or perhaps even minimally qualified. Barons are always searching for the individuals who are both good at something and obedient. Those are the men he selects and puts on a job. They may become permanent functionaries, maybe even a favorite. They are hard to find, and unless otherwise stated, those types do not appear.
Profit or Loss
If the Necessary Skill is…
01-10, modifiers are ± 0
11-13 +1%
14-15 +2%
16-17 +3%
18-19 +4%
20+ +5%

Comments and criticisms are welcome

Do you really want to worry about percentages?

fg,
Thijs

Too granular for me. I'd say keep it simple, +1 for skills above 10, +2 for skills above 20 etc,.

Perhaps you're just gearing up for Pendragon: Book of Accounting, Greg :)

Too granular for me.

newfangled vocabulary! what's "granular" mean here


I'd say keep it simple, +1 for skills above 10, +2 for skills above 20 etc,.

+1 what?


Perhaps you're just gearing up for Pendragon: Book of Accounting, Greg :)

Nope, did that with BoM
Are you guys saying that a percentage calculation is...
...what? yea, granular.

Thijs, your comment is not uh. granular enough for me. :)

OK too detailed. Like a piece of wood under a microscope. I don't need to see the fibers, just the wood will do!

One of the reasons I like the KAP system is because it's simple and not overly detailed. I don't really want to worry about percentages, and little bits here and there - the likes of the "dropped lantern table" from Runequest or the suffocating overkill of AD&D.

Clean, simple, streamlined wins out for me.

I guess what they are trying to say, Greg, is that they don't feel like keeping track of the bureaucracy in that detail for that modest gain. I suspect something like this would be more to their liking:

Normal 'faceless' administrators: normal income
Named very capable 'chancellor': +5%
Named, once-in-a-lifetime 'chancellor' (Becket, Wolsey): +10%

Or whatever you had planned for the named administrators explicitly outside your example scheme.

Thijs, your comment is not uh. granular enough for me. :)


I never mentioned granular :)
I indeed meant that 1% difference is too small to be worth keeping track of.

Now I'll be honest and likely I will never ever run a Baronial household economics.
Any player who has 4 manors or more I declare a 'economic' victor, I stop keeping track of his money and he never has to worry about money again (unless it's a really big expense and then it becomes an adventure).
Knights with 1-3 manors I still use BoM till his income becomes 40+ or so and then I also 'quit' keeping track.
However that does not mean I wont buy any book on Baronial Households because I want to know what kind of NPCs are walking around interacting with my players, but I will never ever use the economics system (because I am not THAT masochistic). Though I would like to know how much a Baron makes on average so I can estimate how much a certain gift is relatively worth... but I wouldnt care whether it's 1200 or 1207, or even 1300 or 900, around 1000 but not 10000 is good enough for me...
[Ok, I am astronomer: I think in orders of magnitude]

fg,
Thijs

I like the idea. It seems simple to implement and gives a reasonable bonus for having the right guy in the job.

The rub, then, will be that the right guy is almost never in the job. Watching the gnashings of teeth as a player Baron has to promote Sir Bungle the incompetent to Sheriff because his father-in-law needs him taken care of and his lady wife won't stop nagging will be priceless.

Likewise when a player knight manages to strongarm himself into a job without the pre-requisites he can see the actual damage he is doing to his Lord's holdings on account of his ambition.

OK too detailed. Like a piece of wood under a microscope. I don't need to see the fibers, just the wood will do!

One of the reasons I like the KAP system is because it's simple and not overly detailed. I don't really want to worry about percentages, and little bits here and there - the likes of the "dropped lantern table" from Runequest or the suffocating overkill of AD&D.

Clean, simple, streamlined wins out for me.

I am confused
What is simpler than you have 2% increase in Value? I've got a £80 estate
My Seneschal gives me £1.6 extra per year

Ah yes, I actually look at what I posted and I see that I have again not explained the circumstances of this "system."
I can imagine what this might look like to the imaginative and creative minds.
I apologize for the confusion that I have caused.

My real point is that I do not like the book keeping either.

Ah yes, I actually look at what I posted and I see that I have again not explained the circumstances of this "system."
I can imagine what this might look like to the imaginative and creative minds.
I apologize for the confusion that I have caused.

My real point is that I do not like the book keeping either.


No probs. Actually I'm guilty of the same. I looked at the post, saw the percentages and just thought I was now going to have to tell my players to get used to figuring percentages of everything. As we already scratch our heads from time to time trying to figure sums with non decimal currency such news would have been greeted with a chorus of groans. :)

As we already scratch our heads from time to time trying to figure sums with non decimal currency such news would have been greeted with a chorus of groans. :)


Amen to that, brother.


T.