Hi – I GMd Pendragon for the first time this last weekend for two players (also first-timers with Pendragon). It went OK although I don’t think I was making the most of traits and passions – that’ll come with experience I think – but I have some questions regarding how this first adventure may end up.

First, Geoff and Morse stop reading if you've found your way here!

Basically I riffed off the basic intro adventure in the 3rd edition rulebook but added a lot of meat to it. The players were knighted at the request of Earl Robert’s wife, the Countess Katherine for ensuring her big birthday celebrations went well (this involved a hunt, a feud with some other squires and fighting some bandits) but were then entrusted by her with a quest. Clues during the adventure have hinted to the players that something is seriously amiss at the northern baronry of the Countess’ brother, Sir Valliard, and she wants them to follow him north and protect him (their knighthood vigil was already interrupted by their foiling an assassination attempt on him). This is where the first session wrapped up but during play the players have acquired enemies in Valliard’s camp and he has made it clear the last thing he wants is attention drawn to his domain.

Now, the second session will allow the players to discover that Valliard is a cruel tyrant who is making a mockery of the King’s Justice and a thinly disguised Robin Hood archetype has declared war on him and also on King Arthur by declaring a sort of free republic within the forest and denying both Valliard and Arthur’s rightful authority. The idea is to present the players with an antagonist (the Robin Hood-type) who by the modern standards of the players would be a hero but to a feudal knight (i.e. their characters) would be an outright villain. Also on the prowl will be a King’s Commissioner – one of many already established in-game as having been sent by Arthur to appraise the value of the estates in his kingdom and investigate injustices. This gives the players a chance to denounce Valliard for his cruelty to the king.

Questions: Assuming the players do this, and it would be the right thing to do to uphold the King’s Justice and an established honourable NPC in his household is the ideal candidate to replace him, they will have broken their vow to their own lord’s wife, Lady Katherine, who asked them to protect her brother not be instrumental in his disinheritance. She will get a Hate passion for the players since they have led to her brother’s disgrace. How to handle Glory and Honour for this? From Arthur’s POV they’ve done him a great service, but in doing so they’ve broken a vow and seriously ticked off their lord’s wife.

Secondly, what happens to Valliard if he lives? My first instinct would be to pack him off on Crusade but, of course, the chronology of Pendragon pre-dates the founding of Islam as a religion. Has crusading found its way into Pendragon in some anachronistic form? Alternatively I might pack him off in disgrace to Ireland since I recently picked up Pagan Shore on eBay and he could recur as an NPC when the players visit the Emerald Isle at some point in the future.

And, thirdly, is my scenario too intriguey for Pendragon? As I say this is our group’s first time with the game, we usually play WHFRP and Cthulhu so I’m slightly aware I might be subconsciously transporting the sort of moral ambiguity of those games into Pendragon where it might not suit. I also have an interest in politics of the C13/14th which is probably seeping in here – appropriate for the game or not?

If intrigue is what your group likes then I say cram as much of it into KAP as you like. How many other games have a skill called intrigue? :)

Moral ambiguity is fine though be prepared for player knights to keep their word to preserve their honour. Getting given shady jobs by hot damsels is a common feature in Malory and can be very revealing of a knight's character.

There are wars a little analogous to the crusades in the GPC. The Irish expedition kicks off in 530 so volunteering could be the way to erase the stain.

Another option might be for them to provide *solid proof* to Countess Katherine and her husband the Count. Note - they are sworn in service *to the Count* not to Katherine.

THEN - after they show the proof they have some options.

Denounce the dastard!
Challenge him.
Encourage the Count to deal with him in some manner.
etc etc

Good luck. I might steal this idea for my campaign (grin)

I had a big post on this that got eaten by a dodgy internet connection. Let's see if I can recapitulate it...

Q1 - How to handle glory and honour.

Firstly only ding their honour for breaking the vow if they actually broke it. A lot will depend upon the terms of the vow here of course.

Secondly however - I would certainly think about dropping their honour for the denunciation of Valliard (how much will depend upon how it actually plays out, but the range of 2-6 points seems about right - see this page (http://www.gspendragon.com/honor1.html) on greg's site for guidelines here). My reasons for this are that they are taking the part of a commoner (and a rebel!) against the rightful feudal lord and one with family connections to their liege to boot. This is a profoundly shocking violation of norms for their class and society and since the Honour passion is in part a measure of their 'credit worthiness' amongst their peers, it should take a significant hit.

The sugar that I would add to this particular pill would be (i) checks against chivalric virtues for doing the right thing even though it offends against their social milieu and (ii) opportunities to 'prove' (in the old sense of the word - as in, a test) their honour over the next few years as various folk pick fights with them for being such deep-dyed cads - by successfully demonstrating their virtue in the court of honour they should by dint of 'right making might' end up net winners in the honour stakes. Of course if they fail to demonstrate their virtue during these consequential challenges they will merely be confirming everyone in their poor opinion.

Thirdly, glory - they don't get task glory for doing what the Countess wanted, but they still get glory for all the normal stuff (defeating enemies, being stylish, important witnesses etc etc). Depending upon how the situation plays out they may get task glory for doing what Arthur wants, plus of course there might be follow on opportunities for glory by virtue of having attracted the notice of the court.


Q2 - What should happen to Valliard?

If Arthur is a paragon of medieval kingship - nothing much, the King knows to stay out of the business of his feudal magnates and Valliard being a petty tyrant on his own lands is well within his rights. Assuming that it can be proven that he has been treading upon Royal perogatives then he will get sanctioned for that but he would have to be actively engaged in armed rebellion before those sanctions threaten the loss of his estates (this sort of thing was only done to proven traitors and sometimes not even then).

If Arthur is a paragon of a modern, 'democratising' kingship - maybe something along the lines that you are thinking, but the stuff I mentioned earlier about shocking violations of feudal norms? This is it in spades. In the GPC there is rebellion led by the sons of Ulfius that happens in 527 or so - my interpretation of the backstory for this event is that this happens because Arthur's meddling do-goodery pisses off the baronage of Logres something rotten. So if you go this way then I would look at tying the Valliard story into the Silchester rebellion in some fashion (alternatively come up with a similar rebellion if you are playing in the early 530s - Duke Hervis is a good candidate for a ringleader IMO).

Question 3 - is this too intriguey?

Generally speaking, my answer is not at all - I love to do this sort of stuff myself. More specifically however, it might be too much for your second session of KAP. You get the best effect from playing against type and undermining the tropes if you've taken some time to establish what the tropes are.

You should also bear in mind that your players may well decide to back Valliard's play, hunt the 'Robin Hood' figure down and hang him from the nearest tree. This is the 'proper' thing to do for their social milieu so it should be the low cost path - maybe a couple of checks to negative traits if they go about it in an egregiously horrible way (but there would be a strong case for a 'Just' check in the mix IMO).

Regards
Luke

Wow, thanks guys for the helpful posts ;D


Another option might be for them to provide *solid proof* to Countess Katherine and her husband the Count. Note - they are sworn in service *to the Count* not to Katherine.

And avoid any nasty repercussions themselves? Yes, players will surprise you but I hope they take things into their oen hands. Knowing the players as I do I suspect one might take your course, the other will be for settling it with cold steel.


If Arthur is a paragon of a modern, 'democratising' kingship - maybe something along the lines that you are thinking

That's my take on it, Arthur as a do-gooder somewhat at odds with the attitudes of many of his nobles. Any denunciation would partly take the form that Valliard's tyranny has led to a situation that has undermined Arthur's own authority. Or perhaps they denounce him only to find Arthur or his man backing Valliard. Hmm....


You should also bear in mind that your players may well decide to back Valliard's play, hunt the 'Robin Hood' figure down and hang him from the nearest tree

Yes, they ought to and I would reward them for doing so. The idea is mess with the players expectations a little by making them more or less obliged to kill a character who is heroic by our own standards. I hadn't really thought that they might not want to bring down Valliard himself but you're right that in feudal terms he might be harsh but unless I really ramp up his villainy not necesserily "wrong". I'll work on that as I would like the players do have the dilemma of maintaining their vow to the Countess vs. serving Arthur's justice even if just for a moment. Unless I thinkof a way to have him having broken his oath of fealty to the King.

There's two weeks of WHFRP before I continue with Pendragon so I've got plenty of time to think about all this - thanks again, especially regards honour loss/gain.