Hi folks,

I am currently using the KAP 5.1 Battle system, not BoB due to a completely new bunch of players still learning vanilla. And I am after a quicker game :)

How do you determine the size of the group that the players will face? In KAP 4th Ed. there was a Group Size random roll to see how many opponents would be faced. This seems to be omitted from KAP 5.1th.

While simple enough to just man up a 1 on 1 contest with every player as the rules do seem to indicate, it seems contrived to do this for every single battle round for every combatant faced. Surely sometimes they will face smaller units, and other times larger ones.

Then also, say the PKs manage to "Seek a Special Event" and roll an Enemy hero or Standard. This could result in say, Small Giants (on the Saxon Enemy table), am I correct in interpreting this as every player knight would face his very own giant? And an extra giant for every other NPC in the unit? That's a big fat OW.

Does anyone use a random +/- adjustment to group size vs. player unit size when assigning enemy targets?

Is this perhaps covered in BoB? I do admit while have purchased the pdf I have not perused too thoroughly, it hurt my brain.

Cheers,
Ben

Although I don't have a ready answer for you, I would like to say that there's a new edition of Book of Battle on the way. Although it doesn't simplify the rules per se, I will say that it clears up many of the ambiguities that were present in the First Edition (both versions) — inconsistencies in labels and so forth — that made that system difficult (for me at least) to learn. It's not that hard once you understand the model, and hopefully everyone will find the model easier to grasp in this new edition! Book of Battle 2nd Edition not only contains a sample battle, but a step-by-step tutorial and updated record sheets to help everything run smoother, and faster. I think it's been submitted for layout, but I dare not offer a release date.

Best,


T.

Having run both systems I prefer BoB but it *is* quite challenging to get to grips with initially. My very first battle was one of confusion (skilfully hidden from my players of course) with on the spot rules and workarounds. Still, it went pretty well and everyone enjoyed themselves. Now that I know what I'm doing, I find BoB only marginally slower than 5.1. I'd stick with 5.1 till you've got a fairly decent grip of BoB then see which system suits you best.



How do you determine the size of the group that the players will face? In KAP 4th Ed. there was a Group Size random roll to see how many opponents would be faced. This seems to be omitted from KAP 5.1th.

I'd run this as 1v1 regardless of the how many PKs you have. You could use a single die roll to determine if they faced more or less opponents on occasion, with 1v1 being the norm.



Then also, say the PKs manage to "Seek a Special Event" and roll an Enemy hero or Standard. This could result in say, Small Giants (on the Saxon Enemy table), am I correct in interpreting this as every player knight would face his very own giant? And an extra giant for every other NPC in the unit? That's a big fat OW.

Indeed it is but battle is brutal. You could always GM fiat and lessen the numbers if the opponents were very tough. Against knights and other such foes I would run it 1v1.



Is this perhaps covered in BoB? I do admit while have purchased the pdf I have not perused too thoroughly, it hurt my brain.


Enemy unit size is not figured in BoB. It's still possible to face more than one opponent (and sometimes less) because of how the system works. Your efforts each round will determine what actions are available to you, and what (and how many) opponents you will face.

Thanks guys for the feedback. I would like to run BoB eventually, once the team is familiar enough with the RAW. I think they are the kind of players that would enjoy the options available to them.

I agree also on further pondering that 1x1 is how I would run it.

A unit of Small Giants would be a tempting target for the Glory on offer with victory, however it's easy enough to make perfectly clear how dangerous such a unit would be to engage, and I'd give the players opportunity to disengage or find a 'regular' unit to beat on.

I think the Crit on Battle to have that option in the first instance would allow for such a choice.

Anyhoo, cheers!