In my latest campaign - which is doing pretty good so far - I have an interesting Roman Christian PK named Sir Flavius. Although he put all his winter points and glory to get APP 23 so he's now called Sir Flawless. That is the first question I could use some ideas on, how to handle a knight with APP 23...

Circumstances and fumble + critical die rolls have made his life even more "interesting". A notorious womanizer of course, it really went downhill in 490 when he missed seeing Igraine at the court. Her legendary beauty actually made him "pretend to be sick" so to remain there while the army went off so he would have a chance to at least see her. (I mean, how unknightly isn't that?). He actually climbed the castle walls to her chambers, but her maiden was there and Igraine refused to see him or let him see her at the window. It was fitting so I let him have a low Amor (Igraine) 12 since he was so persistent.

He decided to ride to the Battle of Lindsey in just a white sash, no armor, to show his purity (and so Igraine, who he hadn't even seen - just heard of - would hear about his commitment). He actually managed to survive Saxon berserkers and the PK's captured the banner (well he had 2 hp left at the end, but he was burning through on a critical passion). He got no major wounds and some really good first aid so he was able to attend the victory feast, where he finally got to see Igraine and BAM critted his lustful of 15, so he now has a directed trait lustful (Igraine) +15 (total of 30!). Worse leering than even Uther followed, and they even confronted each other with a staredown (against the KING!). Only a critical Orate excuse by the most pious, soft and well spoken of the other PK's, and the fact that Uther was drunk on wine and victory saved his hide.

The fact is that ever since the invasion of Frankland, Sir Flavius has detested both Uther and Madoc for going back on their word to Praetor Syagrius. They even managed to secure permission to stay (for honor) of Sir Lycus (since Sir Roderick hadn't been able to join for other reasons) and went to the the severely loosing battle against Claudas and really got their asses kicked (but amazingly survived and got away!). They ended up having to beg their way back to britain and arrived back home rough and on foot late in the winter (loosing out on other things, such as winter bonuses etc).
He later went as far as naming his shabbiest horse after Madoc. Madoc failed his Intrigue and word never reached him (yet), but how would he react I wonder? And how would Uther and Madoc react to hearing curses such as liar, oathbreaker etc under his breath? Probably not well (they actually haven't noticed yet, but it has been close).

Anyway, Sir Flavius lust for Igraine of course went critical (at 30 it would) but things managed to cool down and Sir Roderick sent the knights back to Salisbury ahead of schedule to check on things. Before coming back to Sarum, Flavius went sneaking off back to his manor and his wife Lady Elaine (yes the unfaithful one from the rulesbook) whom he married really only for her estate fully well knowing her reputation. However, over the years he has become more and more Suspicious, especially since she haven't borne him any children (karmic bad rolling). And the last two years he has tried to find out if she cheats and employed staff to check on her etc. He has never found anything out. But now, mad with lust for Igraine he manages to enter the manor unseen and unheard (crit) and strangle Lady Elaine in her sleep - and dumping the body in the river + making it look like she snuck out for some amorous time with a lover - then he gets back to his companions and they arrive at Sarum. The word getting out of their arrival and staff from the manor coming to tell him the sad news of finding his wife drowned in the river. The perfect crime (?). However, how would you handle the honor loss? Also in front of everyone he has no visible diminished honor either.

There's more: another complication, lustful Sir Flavius also has managed to set up a very beautiful young half-saxon(!) maiden in one of his other manors, who even bore him a son the year before. Needless to say, it hasn't been looked upon kindly. But I would like to bring in some more heat.

Karma is a bitch however. In the winterphase, Flavius rolled an 1 and his only son died of sickness :)

Sir Roderick, who was severly injured (and actually nearly died because of one of the PK's) is at last going to come back to Salisbury. I bet he would have a few things to say, but what? And how would Lady Elaines family react? What will happen to the demesne manors that came from her? What is going to happen if anyone with these things if people really find out? How would you punish/reward this in game terms?

A huge proportion of your post seemed fine to me. Having a knight who feigns illness to visit his lady love may be deceitful, but if he did go to the battle at the end, wearing no armour no less, he has done his duty and in a dramatic way.

(By the way, are you aware that inspiration lasts only one round of a battle?)

Also, having a saxon maiden who bears him childreno n the side - there's nothing wrong with that. I don't even give knights lustful checks for that, as long as they are lying back and thinking of England (doing it just for the children, and not actually womanising).

The detestation of Madoc and Uther - depending on how outspoken this is, it could bite him in the ass, but it sounds like a fun thing to get into trouble over.

However, this bit:



But now, mad with lust for Igraine he manages to enter the manor unseen and unheard (crit) and strangle Lady Elaine in her sleep - and dumping the body in the river + making it look like she snuck out for some amorous time with a lover - then he gets back to his companions and they arrive at Sarum. The word getting out of their arrival and staff from the manor coming to tell him the sad news of finding his wife drowned in the river. The perfect crime (?). However, how would you handle the honor loss? Also in front of everyone he has no visible diminished honor either.

I'd be thinking of Love (Family) first - there's a 5-10 point loss (or maybe drop to half) penalthy straight away.
Then, Honour: I believe there is a big penalty listed in the rulebook for murdering a noblewoman, again, something in the region of 5-10 points IIRC.

I don't require people to know about crimes against honour to impose the penalty. The knight in question knows, and he *is* no longer honourable and can't rely on the passion as well, so down it goes.

That said, this might be a special case. In my game, when a player was about to do something so heinous, I'd ask the player if he realised what it would cost, because players used to normal fantasy game antics are sometimes unprepared for the kinds of penalties suffered in Pendragon. Often, players have said, "I'd lose what??? Um, in that case I won't do it."

Plus, knights in Arthurian tales often do heinous things when caught up in the throes of a passion (witness Balin's murder of a lady in full view of King Arthur), so I'd be inclined to be more lenient - especially if it's meat for future plot. Which leads to...


Sir Roderick, who was severly injured (and actually nearly died because of one of the PK's) is at last going to come back to Salisbury. I bet he would have a few things to say, but what? And how would Lady Elaines family react? What will happen to the demesne manors that came from her? What is going to happen if anyone with these things if people really find out? How would you punish/reward this in game terms?

Taking in turn:
Uther and/or Madoc hearing about the namecalling: if any knight with a loyalty to the high king hears about this, you can bet there'll be challenges. If Roderick or the earl's advisors hears about it, the knight will probably be ordered to shut it (giving him a nice loyalty conflict), and may either be sent far away whenever the king visits, OR, more entertainingly, be ordered by the Earl to do some specific service for the King to show

The saxon maiden: no-one will really care. That's normal.

The murder of his wife: there's so much wrong with that one. If the Earl finds out, he'll be obligated to at the very least banish the knight, maybe even strip him of his knighthood. If the wife's family find out, there's a bunch of instant Hates to deal with. Any and all knights who have Love Family or Amours or Honour at 16+ are likely to regard the knight very badly, and seek to punish him. I wouldn't set out to punish him for it though - in Pendragon, if he gets challenged over it, and wins the duel, he has proved the right of his actions however heinous (or at least, if he claims innocence and fights a duel, and wins, he has proved it). That won't stop family members with hates coming after him, but that's fun.

Basically I would NOT go out of my way to punish the player for the actions of his character. I'd look on this incident as an opportunity to throw fun challenges and complications his way, while also demonstrating to the group how the Pendragon world would react to this kind of event. Handled properly, the player will learn something about Pendragon, and may not do similar things in future (or if he does, it'll be with full knowledge of what awaits him).













[/quote]

(By the way, are you aware that inspiration lasts only one round of a battle?)


Since when? The inspiration rules state that the bonus "lasts for the length of the task at hand, but never more than one full day."

So someone inspiration in a battle would keep the bonus as long as the reason for it remained. So if someone was inspired by Hate (Saxons) he'd get the bonus as long as there were Saxons at the battle. If someone was inspired by Hate (Cedric) and then killed Cedric, the inspiration would usually wear off.







As far a Sir Flawless goes, I can think of several difficulties he will have in store for him.

First off, lusting after the High King's wife (or future wife) is not exactly the best career move. If Uther finds out about it, the Knight might find himself being sent on some really unpleasant missions, as far away as possible.

Worse still, Ygraine might take a liking to the attractive knight and then he'd really be in trouble.

And there is every possibility of some other women taking a liking to the knight, many of whom he might not want the attentions of. Or the "retribution" of any husbands, relatives or suitors who even suspect there is something going on.

As for the Saxon maiden, her family would be out for blood, and everybody would understand why.


The murder presents even more difficulties. Maybe some servant saw the deed?


Another thing is, since this is all happening early in the campaign, when chivalry is new and romance unheard of, his actions probably won't impress people with his purity and love as much as his stupidity and recklessness.

Courtly romance, is decades away.

So the way I see it, Sir Flavius is probably not long for the world. Sooner of later one of his misadventures are going to come back to finish him off. Or, more likely, several of them. I could see Flavius getting sent on some mission by Uther (or through Brastias, who might figure this out and decides to deal with this before it turns into a problem) with his route "somehow" being known to the wronged Saxons who "just happen" to set up an ambush.

Edited to correct quotes

Since when? The inspiration rules state that the bonus "lasts for the length of the task at hand, but never more than one full day."

So someone inspiration in a battle would keep the bonus as long as the reason for it remained. So if someone was inspired by Hate (Saxons) he'd get the bonus as long as there were Saxons at the battle. If someone was inspired by Hate (Cedric) and then killed Cedric, the inspiration would usually wear off.


I don't have my book on hand (so someone else will have to quote the page please), but it does specifically say that inspiration lasts for 1 round in a battle. I think it's either in the Passions or Battle section of KAP 5. He only gets the bonus for Hate (Saxons) during the battle for as long as he is fighting that unit of Saxons that he inspired the passions for.

You both bring up some good points along the lines of my thinking, it helps - thanks :D

As for passion in battle - I normally let it last just one round, but in epic or special cases, or with a critical, I'll let it run as long as needed for it to be a good story :)

Actually, the player is quite experienced with Pendragon - he's fully aware of the potential consequences of his actions. It was beatifully roleplayed as well.

I have been toying with the idea to put him into even more trouble with Igraine, as he IS a very very handsome and charming knight. We'll see, I do have some other plans for her...

Your thoughts on the half-saxon maiden are interesting. Not much of a scandal really - its a woman. I guess I can see that now.

I like the idea about either Brastias or Roderick giving him the special mission. I could also do something through Ulfius since he actually have some respect for him.

Murder witnesses, well I have been keeping that kinda open, but after all he critted two rolls there.

We've had the discussion that he's quite out of fashion, since romance isn't really around yet (although that didn't stop GPC from slamming on amours for Igraine-watching). However, Flavius amor is long gone, he lost it when he gained the directed trait Lust (igraine) for a total of 30. Also, it was kind of fun at the session that everyone thought he was mad, his companions tried to protect him and no one was impressed (unlike they would be 30 years later). Very good points though.

My first inclination was to remove 8 honor from him, but we had a bit of an argument about the validity of that - so I said we'll wait until next session and I'll decide then. I might reduce it to -6, but that is what I gave another PK for killing his no-good-brute-of-a-brother in honest self-defense the session before that. Kinslaying is kinslaying.

Thanks for reminding me that arthurian lore is really full of knights doing the most vile things imaginable, but still maintaining many knightly virtues. Putting it like that, Sir Flavius is quite arthurian in nature after all :). And he is well played - if a bit over the top sometimes, but its nothing like your regular fantasy game antics really. He also had a few bad years, with fumbles and crits in the wrong places, all his friends bearing healthy children - and his wife not bearing him anything and a nasty GM in me playing up the jealousy angle on her. I also made both Uther and Madoc seem quite unsympathetic (as they should be), especially in his worldview.

I'm also of the opinion that my job is not to go out and punish the PK for "morals", and I have no intention of doing that. I let it lie where it may, but actions do have consequences. Anyway, he's already managed to severly punish himself AND dice karma had a real thing for him in the winter phase taking both money and only child. What I didn't mention was also that the manor servants also told him his wife was finally pregnant (I love those dice sometimes)... Oh cruel world :)

On top of that, the other PK's do wonder what he's been up to. One of them have the intrigue family characteristic and there are some suspicions. Oh yes, Sir Flavius will feel the noose tighten. Any ideas/suggestions how to slowly increase the pressure? Could have some fun with that :)

I don't have my book on hand (so someone else will have to quote the page please), but it does specifically say that inspiration lasts for 1 round in a battle. I think it's either in the Passions or Battle section of KAP 5. He only gets the bonus for Hate (Saxons) during the battle for as long as he is fighting that unit of Saxons that he inspired the passions for.


Yes, please if somebody does have the page please quite it. I couldn't find anything along those lines for inspiration, only the line I quoted above, stating that it lasts for as long as the cause of the passion roll, but no more that a day.

I don't have my book on hand (so someone else will have to quote the page please), but it does specifically say that inspiration lasts for 1 round in a battle. I think it's either in the Passions or Battle section of KAP 5. He only gets the bonus for Hate (Saxons) during the battle for as long as he is fighting that unit of Saxons that he inspired the passions for.


Yes, please if somebody does have the page please quite it. I couldn't find anything along those lines for inspiration, only the line I quoted above, stating that it lasts for as long as the cause of the passion roll, but no more that a day.


It may have missed the rule book, but it's in the Q&A http://www.gspendragon.com/questionsanswers.html under passions.

Your thoughts on the half-saxon maiden are interesting. Not much of a scandal really - its a woman. I guess I can see that now.


Medieval notions of race and racism were very different from more modern ones. Though racial stereotypes abound (Normans are reckless but skilled warriors, Greeks are oversophisticated cowards), other factors like cultural and religious similarities were more important. As long as she speaks English (?) more than Anglo-Saxon, doesn't make any sacrifices to Thor or Odin, and doesn't have any close Saxon advisors or family members who might appear to be using the woman to promote a Saxon agenda, I wouldn't think it's a big issue. Saxon blood is less important than a Saxon heart or a Saxon soul or a Saxon tongue.

Edit:

The big difference between medieval and modern racism is that the former is not predominantly about skin colour. Instead, it’s the more basic idea that all foreigners are strange and have bizarre habits, with ‘foreigner’ expandable as necessary to encompass anyone coming from more than X miles away. Although medieval racism could lead to war atrocities (e.g. English versus Welsh) or opportunistic killings (attacks on Flemings in London), not much of it gets to the level of later European racism, with lesser breeds treated as subhuman. We also need to take care not to read back the current hierarchies of undesirables into the Middle Ages: I’d argue, for example, that the Carolingians were probably more prejudiced about Greeks than Muslims.
From http://magistraetmater.blog.co.uk/2009/08/26/medieval-attitudes-and-mental-exercises-6825281/

It may have missed the rule book, but it's in the Q&A http://www.gspendragon.com/questionsanswers.html under passions.


Yes, it does. Thanks for the link. :)

It's a significant change, too. It makes the whole "for the duration of the task, or until the end of the day line" fairly pointless.

Well... Sir Flawless did catch her singing strange lullabies to their (now dead) son. She also have some strange customs, and won't show up at church (neither will Flavius though). And her name is Sigyn and she has very beautiful long blond hair.

I guess Greg's "new" Honor rules from the web: http://gspendragon.com/honor1.html could be put in effect, just wondering how much secret guilt to stack on :)

It may have missed the rule book, but it's in the Q&A http://www.gspendragon.com/questionsanswers.html under passions.


Yes, it does. Thanks for the link. :)

It's a significant change, too. It makes the whole "for the duration of the task, or until the end of the day line" fairly pointless.


Only in the context of battle.
It's still perfectly applicable to many other activities like, say, Hunting (which could take more than one day).

Only in the context of battle.
And tournaments,specifically the grand melee, which I would think would be handled like a battle for this rule. If a knight tries for inspiration to impress a lady with great deeds on the battlefield he will need to make multiple passion rolls.

I guess that means the "failing a task" penalty no longer applies after 1 battle round, too.




It's still perfectly applicable to many other activities like, say, Hunting (which could take more than one day).

Yes, and I don't think that's right.I think the bonus should stop after the first hunting segment or at least after finding the first beast.

I agree the default should be 1 round of battle/tournament/hunting etc and that is the way I play it.
Unless there is a critical (which might make the passion burn longer, a few more rounds perhaps), it suits the story (same thing) or at the gamemasters whim :).

I mean, I bet you can stay angry/inspired/enamored for more than 30 minutes at a time... sometimes...

Does one round of battle refer to, well, only battles, or also to normal combats?

I mean, I bet you can stay angry/inspired/enamored for more than 30 minutes at a time... sometimes...


According to the way the rules were written, as well as in life, certainly. It's not like the clock strike 4:31 and the passion instantly wears off.




I'm also of the opinion that my job is not to go out and punish the PK for "morals", and I have no intention of doing that. I let it lie where it may, but actions do have consequences. Anyway, he's already managed to severly punish himself AND dice karma had a real thing for him in the winter phase taking both money and only child. What I didn't mention was also that the manor servants also told him his wife was finally pregnant (I love those dice sometimes)... Oh cruel world

I disagree with you here. Pendragon is all about morality. Just not modern morality. It is certainly part of the GMs job to include that and "punish" when necessary. The Grail Quest in particular comes to
mond.

That said, O think you are on the right track with "actions have consequences". In this case, the situation is less about some sort of spiritual trial and punishment, and more about dealing with the consequences of some very extreme actions.Sir Flavius has managed to give just cause for several people to be angry with him, from a Saxons, to his in-laws (What would you think if your daughter/sister/cousin were strangled with some excuse about an unknown lover? What would you think if you knew about her husband's promiscuity and suspected love for another woman? I'd be suspicious.), to the Queen, to the King, to his own Liege Lord.

He's done some many things that something will happen. Just what, and by who is the question.

BTW, another possibility would be for the Saxons to show up at the Earl's court and insist on Flavius "doing the right thing" and marring their daughter. It would be a interesting turn of events. If Flavius accepts, he's got a new wife and some new in-laws. If not, he's made some strong enemies (and I guess where some of those Saxon raids are going to be directed at during the Anarchy period).

It's a good thing the player is experienced with the game and aware of the nature of his actions. ;D

Does one round of battle refer to, well, only battles, or also to normal combats?


The Q&A states "one battle round or single combat". So in a normal combat it would appear to last for an entire fight with one opponent. So if you get triple teamed by bandits, make sure to kill the one who inspired the hate last. >:(

Maybe we should put this bit into a different thread and let Archamian get back to the "Tale of Sir Flavius"

(By the way, are you aware that inspiration lasts only one round of a battle?)


Since when? The inspiration rules state that the bonus "lasts for the length of the task at hand, but never more than one full day."



Page 60.
Each passion can be used only once per day and the effects last for one full battle round.

This is a different time scale.

--Greg

(By the way, are you aware that inspiration lasts only one round of a battle?)


Since when? The inspiration rules state that the bonus "lasts for the length of the task at hand, but never more than one full day."



Page 60.
Each passion can be used only once per day and the effects last for one full battle round.

This is a different time scale.

Page 60? What edition? KAP 5 has the Salisbury stuff on page 60.

--Greg
[/quote]

I mean, I bet you can stay angry/inspired/enamored for more than 30 minutes at a time... sometimes...


According to the way the rules were written, as well as in life, certainly. It's not like the clock strike 4:31 and the passion instantly wears off.




I'm also of the opinion that my job is not to go out and punish the PK for "morals", and I have no intention of doing that. I let it lie where it may, but actions do have consequences. Anyway, he's already managed to severly punish himself AND dice karma had a real thing for him in the winter phase taking both money and only child. What I didn't mention was also that the manor servants also told him his wife was finally pregnant (I love those dice sometimes)... Oh cruel world

I disagree with you here. Pendragon is all about morality. Just not modern morality. It is certainly part of the GMs job to include that and "punish" when necessary. The Grail Quest in particular comes to
mond.

That said, O think you are on the right track with "actions have consequences". In this case, the situation is less about some sort of spiritual trial and punishment, and more about dealing with the consequences of some very extreme actions.Sir Flavius has managed to give just cause for several people to be angry with him, from a Saxons, to his in-laws (What would you think if your daughter/sister/cousin were strangled with some excuse about an unknown lover? What would you think if you knew about her husband's promiscuity and suspected love for another woman? I'd be suspicious.), to the Queen, to the King, to his own Liege Lord.

He's done some many things that something will happen. Just what, and by who is the question.

BTW, another possibility would be for the Saxons to show up at the Earl's court and insist on Flavius "doing the right thing" and marring their daughter. It would be a interesting turn of events. If Flavius accepts, he's got a new wife and some new in-laws. If not, he's made some strong enemies (and I guess where some of those Saxon raids are going to be directed at during the Anarchy period).

It's a good thing the player is experienced with the game and aware of the nature of his actions. ;D



Perhaps I should clarify what I actually meant. In my experience it's very common for gamemasters to "arbitrarily" punish the players when he doesn't agree with them himself. Sticking with the Pendragon game and feel here, i feel that that punishment should only be met out "justly" only according to cause/effect in the gameworld. And so the GM will get his check in Just :). He's not getting off the hook...

I really hadn't thought about it at all, but I absolutely love your idea of a group of heavily armed, but slightly tentative non-agressive SAXONS! (oh the shock and the wide-eyed staring!) showing up at court and demanding the marriage upon their honor! It will open up all sorts of interesting avenues for further adventures depending on the outcome. Sir Roderick might even (wierdly) feel honorally inclined to force the marriage. After all, the Saxons have surprisingly come with courtesy and honor and demanded it. And Sir Roderick might feel its best not to draw the Saxon wrath too much and possibly save his people some raiding (I like making Sir Roderick quite the meek, but reasonably sympathetic fellow). She might even be a daughter to one of the Saxon lords (or to really screw things up, a runaway daughter to the Bretwalda!). In any case, Sir Flavius is REALLY gonna hear about it at court, on adventures and even on the battlefield! For years and years. At least it made him somewhat famous...

O know what you mean about arbitrary GMs, ans agree with you. It's just that in Sir Flavius' case, he's done several things that will lead to consequences.

Saxon Violence: Another thing you might consider is to have Flavius' in-laws suspect Saxon treachery. Maybe the Saxon's murdered Flavius' wife in order to clear the path for their own daughter?

Considering the social and political ramifications the marriage could become somewhat significant during the anarchy phase. It would certainly be worth noting which faction Flavius' might be marrying into an alliance with. Or, who he's insulted if he refuses.

And he does live in Salisbury, where everybody has a Hate (Saxons) passion.

Since when? The inspiration rules state that the bonus "lasts for the length of the task at hand, but never more than one full day."

Page 60.
Each passion can be used only once per day and the effects last for one full battle round.
This is a different time scale.


Page 60? What edition? KAP 5 has the Salisbury stuff on page 60.


Book of Battle

Page 60? What edition? KAP 5 has the Salisbury stuff on page 60.

[/quote]
Book of Battle
[/quote]

Ah.
I don't have that one, yet.

SADLY It is often VERY entertaintaining to play a character Like Flavius, but usually they have a short life expectancy. The players and GM should thank him for making the game enjoyable while he rolls up a new character! I would have ripped the player up! :) sorry but I would of!!!!!!!!! You just dont live long irritating Kings and murdering rich noblewomen. Very entertaining , no doubt. In my campaign I can tell you that sir Flavius would have lost a lot of honour. At least 8-10 points im imagining. It doesnt matter if ' NO ONE KNOWS " . You still lose it. Passions are helpful sometimes , but as you can see in the case of a high passion score they can be your undoing. didn't Trystan and Isolde teach us this!!!!! I am very glad that he was entertaining. I think He really thickened the plot and it was probably a riot, but you can only go against the grain for so long before it catches up with you! Curiously... how much honor did Flavius lose for his transgressions? :P if you dont mind my asking, that is...

Yeah, high Passions (and even high traits) are a (tragic) flaw in Pendragon characters.

Everything else aside, nothing good is probably going to result from a character getting a directed Trait of Lustful (Ygrane) +15.

If he is smart/lucky the PK can jump in the waters off Tintagel, cool off, and find an excuse to get out of there before he see her again. If not, well, he'll probably make a move of some sort, and suffer for it. It's a tragedy waiting to happen.

It's not nice, but it's the way things are in Arthurian Literature. If the heroes could control their traits and passions, the whole story would have ended very differently.

In my current campaign, one player has a Lust ygrain of 30 (with the directed trait added in), and it's recently entered the anarchy and he is courting her.

This was going pretty well - I am open to the idea of him marrying her, and who knows, he might even be one of the people agitating to be the next High King during the anarchy.

He has hit a small hurdle though. She discovered he was the person who helped Merlin abduct her baby, and - after quite some effort - he told her he had been tricked and ensorcelled, and vowed to kill Merlin (he is Reckless and Proud). He then went off and did just that, or so he thought. Only upon brandishing the head at court, it had decomposed and was unidentified. But his Honesty is famous (and he made his roll against Ygraine's Hate), so she is starting to accept the truth of it. Once she finds out merlin still lives, he will be accused of being still in league with Merlin and trying to deceive Ygraine, with Honour poised to plummet for the third time because of Merlin...

Needless to say, Merlin is not his favourite person. Should he get his way and marry Ygraine, I can't see him accepting Merlin's brat when 510 rolls around...

Yeah, high Passions (and even high traits) are a (tragic) flaw in Pendragon characters.

Everything else aside, nothing good is probably going to result from a character getting a directed Trait of Lustful (Ygrane) +15.

If he is smart/lucky the PK can jump in the waters off Tintagel, cool off, and find an excuse to get out of there before he see her again. If not, well, he'll probably make a move of some sort, and suffer for it. It's a tragedy waiting to happen.

It's not nice, but it's the way things are in Arthurian Literature. If the heroes could control their traits and passions, the whole story would have ended very differently.




Well said. :)

Well said. :)


Do I get a check in Compose? ;D

It strikes me that I should report here what actually happened with Sir Flavius (the late). It was some great and really fun sessions.

Basically, the Saxons came to visit and demand their runaway chieftain's daughter back (shock!) or payment or forced marriage AND payment. Basically payment, and more payment, and some in blood as well - why not? After much fun and trouble (and no Sigyn really really didn't want to go back), they couldn't work it out so it was decided that god would decide (or in this case Wotan) so he had to have a duel with Wulfgar, his saxon nemesis for the honor and payment in blood. A great build up with a night of vigil, borrowing a reinforced chainmail, getting blessed and using a great 9p legionarius shield didn't help at all since Wulfgar just ran across the courtyard and flat out killed him with the first axe blow. Gotta love those crits :) Then the PK's just had to stand by and watch as the Saxons dragged the woman away kicking and screaming...

What an interesting end. Sir Flavius certainly gave you lots of threads to tug on, it was just a matter of which one came unravelled first.

Dying gloriously in single combat against a Saxon at least means he is likely to be remembered for that, not for mooning after Ygraine, murdering his wife, etc...