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Sir Pramalot
02-14-2010, 01:52 PM
Looking at the overland travel rates from the GPC (p.21) they strike me as being a little low. Normally, when travel is not really part of the adventure, I just abstract it, but when travel is the adventure it becomes important.

MY PKs will soon be traveling along the coast close to the Seven Sisters and Beachy Head, an area of undulating, but essentially open grassland with no road. This means a rate of 2 miles per day at normal rates which seems extremely miserly. 2 miles per day across open grass on horseback? You could walk that 4 times over. Once I add in the fact that this is Saxon land, so my PKs will most likely travel cautiously, we're down to half a mile a day.

Earl De La Warr
02-14-2010, 06:28 PM
A horses natural environment would be open grassy plains. So long as the grass is not too long, the ground is not broken, littered with waterways or rocky I cannot see how it could be slower than a road. In fact given the conditions of some roads after a downpour, it may even be quicker.

Remember that Attila the Hun and later Genghiz Khan were able to travel great distances on horse 'off road'. A more modern trope, is the 'Wild west' where roads hardly existed but didn't seem to hinder travel (at least not in most films).

I don't know the area you speak of, but I'd trust your judgement on that.

Greg Stafford
02-14-2010, 07:25 PM
Looking at the overland travel rates from the GPC (p.21) they strike me as being a little low. Normally, when travel is not really part of the adventure, I just abstract it, but when travel is the adventure it becomes important.

MY PKs will soon be traveling along the coast close to the Seven Sisters and Beachy Head, an area of undulating, but essentially open grassland with no road. This means a rate of 2 miles per day at normal rates which seems extremely miserly. 2 miles per day across open grass on horseback? You could walk that 4 times over. Once I add in the fact that this is Saxon land, so my PKs will most likely travel cautiously, we're down to half a mile a day.


I made these low because I wanted to emphasize the difference between modern travel and olden days.
These travel rates are based on these assumptions:

--you know where you are going, and have some directions, but have not been there before
--there are no signs
--you can ask people the way, if there are any, and if they will stick around long enough to talk (unlikely)
--it is mixed terrain, not undulating (grassland)
--cautious = doing everything to avoid detection, which is actually hampered by open space

That said, the high end is probably to high, and the low end too low.

Greg Stafford
02-14-2010, 07:40 PM
Remember that Attila the Hun and later Genghiz Khan were able to travel great distances on horse 'off road'.


That is not a fair comparison.
Nomadic invaders are used to traveling long distances, have multiple mounts, and when they were invading didn't even seem to stop to eat.
Knights ride heavy mounts, and travel with heavier equipment.



A more modern trope, is the 'Wild west' where roads hardly existed but didn't seem to hinder travel (at least not in most films).


I myself don't trust movies for facts.
And once again, the comparison of knights traveling with nomadic plains tribes is not 1:1.
Finally, the natives know where they are going.

I'll just emphasize here that we modern's are spoiled to decadence with our age and haven't much clue about what natural life is about.
You might be surprised to realize how much of an obstacle a six foot deep and wide crevice is for a horse.
Seasonal creeks can be very fast, wide and deep.
We are not talking about that modern, 100% tamed English countryside so well groomed for rambling.
I would not say there in much virgin land in Arthur's Logres (save those reclaimed by the fay)--the forests close to the settlements, are known and even tended.
But most of it is unsettled, wildish if not wild, still widely covered with forests.

Spoonist
02-15-2010, 09:01 AM
Ancient/Medieval funfact:
A messenger on foot is faster in the long run than a messenger on horse. ;D That is, if you ride on the horse and do not use any spares. Horses are great for sprints etc but their stamina is highly reduced when having a rider and some other gear to hamper them.

So to add to Greg's comment above you have to add all of these things when traveling leasurely/cautiously:
Striking camp. Anyone who has been hiking can attest to that striking camp can take suprising amount of time. Add to this that most stuff you own is modern material that is light weight and water resistant. Back in those days you had to pack right or you would have to stop to get stuff dry again and sometimes you ended up with rotting fabric.
You can only travel when its light enough to see where the horse is stepping or risk injuries. It was common to have to stop fully when there where rains etc.
Grooming the horse, because if you don't they will get sick. 15-60 min/day depending on weather and use. More if they get a lose shoe etc.
Grazing the horse. They need food and bringing oats etc will weigh so much that you need another horse, which also needs food...
Cooking. Food that last and food you find on the way have one thing in common; they need to be prepared. Ready to eat food is expensive and weigh more which leads to more horses.
Setting camp. Especially important when in hostile territory.
Maintenance of arms. Otherwise it will rust etc.

Add to that alll things that can and will go wrong it starts to become bothersome.


But reality is usually no fun and it would be too complex to create a "realistic" system.
So increase the speed as you see fit, here are some that should give a bonus:
Good dry weather.
Extra horses, both riding and packing.
Exchanging horses along the way. A common business for inns etc. (and ripe with fraud)
Hiring a local guide. (very common back in those days, but risky =)
Expensive food.
Reckless use of the horses. (roll some extra death checks)
Reduced gear.
Reckless use of the men. (HP & fatigue loss)
etc