I've been going over the Book of Knight & Ladies and it has raised some questions about the armor.

1) I see Cuirbolii listed as 8 points rather than 6. Is this a change from KAP, or is it an improved form of cuirboli, or perhaps worn over a dublet? I'm just wondering it I should up the Saxons to 8 point armor, or assume they have something else that protects for 6 (leather & rings?).

2) Nasal Helm and Chainmail is listed at 11 points. Is the extra point due to the helm, or is the armor also improved? If a character with 10 point chainmail were to get a nasal helm would it equate to 11 points of protection?

3) In the Occitanian Luck Table there is a fantastic helmet that give +2 armor. How would this work as time goes by and the armor escalates? For example, if a character during the Anarchy Peroid started off in Mail and Open Helm (10 Points), but latter on was able to acquire partial plate and closed helm, how would the fantastic helm work? Does the newer, closed helm suddenly become "fantastic" and provide the same benefits? Or does the knight have an open helm that protects as good as a closed one?

2) Nasal Helm and Chainmail is listed at 11 points. Is the extra point due to the helm, or is the armor also improved? If a character with 10 point chainmail were to get a nasal helm would it equate to 11 points of protection?


If a mere nasal added a point of armor, everybody would quickly get one instead of just the rich.

I've always played it as representing more complete mail over the body. Look at the Bayeux Tapestry -- most Normans are wearing mail with short sleeves and no leggings, while William the Conqueror has extra pieces covering forearm and legs (very visible where he's lifting his helm to show his army that he's still alive). So the body's fully covered, but it's only 11 points because he only has a nasal helm, and only the very rich have it because a) it costs more and b) it's not as comfortable as the fully developed 12-point 1200's-equivalent armor (they're still working out the kinks like those separate mail vambraces).

I've been going over the Book of Knight & Ladies and it has raised some questions about the armor.
3) In the Occitanian Luck Table there is a fantastic helmet that give +2 armor. How would this work as time goes by and the armor escalates? For example, if a character during the Anarchy Peroid started off in Mail and Open Helm (10 Points), but latter on was able to acquire partial plate and closed helm, how would the fantastic helm work? Does the newer, closed helm suddenly become "fantastic" and provide the same benefits? Or does the knight have an open helm that protects as good as a closed one?


You could say the helmet is so well made that it continually offers a +2 armor. Maybe it's superior because it has a brim or visor that protects the face almost as well as a full face plate, that's why it's +2 to begin with (but the importance of the visor is lost on the knight, so others don't know to have the smiths make one in the same style. That would explain why not everyone has one) . Or maybe it's fantastic quality steel. Spanish armor gives bonuses as well, and Occitania is near Spain (actually IIRC Catalonia is considered Occitania in the BoKL) and it was acquire a generation or so ago as the spoils of war.

Or, you could say it's made of bronze. IIRC my ancient history professor said that pound for pound bronze armor was better than iron armor, but also more expensive (since bronze requires tin to manufacture, and tin is relatively rare). So you could say that it's made of bronze and doesn't fit into the normal progression of armor. Unlike iron and steel, bronze doesn't rust either, so it's plausible that it has survived to become an heirloom simply for that reason.

Or, you could just say it can be modified to keep it up to current standards. So when face plates become the fashion, a skilled blacksmith can bolt one on. Of course the face plate won't be of the same quality as the rest of the helmet, but it's good enough to still earn the bonus.

Or, you could say that it already has a faceplate. Maybe it belonged to some Roman cataphract or clibanar (or however you spell the singular of clibanarii). In that case it would likely already cover the full face. Likewise an old Greek style Corinthian helmet (of the type worn my hoplites) already covers most of the face. It's possible it was either found in some dusty tomb by some ancestor, or even that it really has been passed down for generations (there were ancient Greek colonies in Occitania so the Corinthian idea may not be as far fetched as it seems).

2) Nasal Helm and Chainmail is listed at 11 points. Is the extra point due to the helm, or is the armor also improved? If a character with 10 point chainmail were to get a nasal helm would it equate to 11 points of protection?


If a mere nasal added a point of armor, everybody would quickly get one instead of just the rich.

I've always played it as representing more complete mail over the body. Look at the Bayeux Tapestry -- most Normans are wearing mail with short sleeves and no leggings, while William the Conqueror has extra pieces covering forearm and legs (very visible where he's lifting his helm to show his army that he's still alive). So the body's fully covered, but it's only 11 points because he only has a nasal helm, and only the very rich have it because a) it costs more and b) it's not as comfortable as the fully developed 12-point 1200's-equivalent armor (they're still working out the kinks like those separate mail vambraces).


That makes sense to me. Historically there were a lot of improvements to mail. The "Nasal Helm Mail" could have thicker, strong links or some such.

Although that would make the 10 point curiboilli and nasal helm suspect, unless it was an improved form of cuirboilli. Maybe it reinforced with bits of metal?

or maybe you could accept that it's magical, like pretty much every item on the luck tables is.

or maybe you could accept that it's magical, like pretty much every item on the luck tables is.



The thing with the helm, is "+2 to what". All the armor values given in KAP 5 include a type of helm. So if a player knight starts with this in 485 as part of a set of "Mail+Open Helm [10 point+2 for helm], how does it work in 450 when the knight's grandson is wearing it with plate? Is it the same as "Full Plate + closed helm [16 points+2 for helm] but that doesn't make sense since the helm is still an old style open helm.

But with KAP5 we can't assemble the armor the way we could in KAP3 and 4.

An open helm in 485 probably wouldn't give a +2 bonus either. I would just say, regardless of style, this helm gives +2 to whatever armour it's worn with.

So, in 550, you have a nice suit of full plate, with a possibly open helm*, that protects for 2 points more than normal plate - the helm is that good.

* Does it say what kind of helm is? You could just say, "this is an unusual, unheard of closed helm design, that is superior to the helms that will be worn 100 years from now and no-one knows how to copy it (maybe because it was made by a dwarf, or uses special metals that fell from the sky, or whatever)."