Message from Greg:


A week or so ago, I said that I was putting together a table with all the manors of Salisbury on it, as show on Dr. J.M.'s map, and asked if anyone else was interested in such a table.

You mentioned an interest.

I did the table, as well as laying a grid over his map, and noting the grid reference for the manors to make them easier to locate on the map.

But since then, there has been a request to replace the ugly grid with a nicer, grid-less border (serves me right, I asked for input and got some). Since I'm not sure how much longer it will take for me to finish the new map, I thought I'd send you the original version. It is perfectly functional if not nearly as artistic. Plus, this way, if there is something horribly wrong, I can change if before I release it to the masses.

I've got a list and register in the works so GMs could track who owns what manner and things like arms, income and such. They'll get finished after I get that new map border finished.

The file can be found on www.gspendragon.com (http://www.gspendragon.com) or through the direct link: www.gspendragon.com/pendragonmanortable.pdf (http://www.gspendragon.com/pendragonmanortable.pdf)

Message from Greg:
I believe that this list is by Andrew Williams






A week or so ago, I said that I was putting together a table with all the manors of Salisbury on it, as show on Dr. J.M.'s map, and asked if anyone else was interested in such a table.

You mentioned an interest.

I did the table, as well as laying a grid over his map, and noting the grid reference for the manors to make them easier to locate on the map.

But since then, there has been a request to replace the ugly grid with a nicer, grid-less border (serves me right, I asked for input and got some). Since I'm not sure how much longer it will take for me to finish the new map, I thought I'd send you the original version. It is perfectly functional if not nearly as artistic. Plus, this way, if there is something horribly wrong, I can change if before I release it to the masses.

I've got a list and register in the works so GMs could track who owns what manner and things like arms, income and such. They'll get finished after I get that new map border finished.

The file can be found on www.gspendragon.com (http://www.gspendragon.com) or through the direct link: www.gspendragon.com/pendragonmanortable.pdf (http://www.gspendragon.com/pendragonmanortable.pdf)

Not wishing to take credit for something that isn't mine, I must say the grid was not done by me.

Instead
- Someone unknown at White Wolf or Chaosium created the original black and white map.
- Andrew Williams (me) created the colour version.
- Dr. J.M. did the text.
- Atgxtg did the grid overlay.

I happened to be emailing with Matthijs about the manor placement and such just a couple of days ago (due to my interest in Salisbury for the new campaign and having found this nice map, thanks to everyone working on it!). Not trying to claim any credit in anything that has been done, mind you. But I figured I'd share some minor tweaks just in case people are wondering.

I believe that Matthijs has a list of minor map tweaks that he hopes to include to the final version (KAP 6.0?), rather than doing the work of tweaking the map over and over again.

Best wishes,
Morien


Forwarded email:

Question about the map you are using...

Are you limited by the locations of the manors already marked on the map? If you are, ignore the following.

Because I was looking it over and Chitterne would be much better corresponding with real maps if it were shifted to the other, unused river on the west. And that would make that corner of the map a bit more settled.

(Morien adds in the forum: I see there is Chitterne Anstey on the map now.)

I'd also tempted to ditch Over Wallop, or shift the three Wallops slightly... Over Wallop is supposed to be (north-)west of Middle Wallop, and now it is northeast instead.

Google placement:
Shift Nether Wallop across the stream to the east (and maybe a small, minuscule nudge northwards). Move Middle Wallop where Over Wallop is now, and then move Over Wallop on the west bank of the stream, opposite to Middle Wallop. Then it would fit better.

Defensively:
Forget about Over Wallop and keep everything on the western bank. It would make sense to keep the river between you and Harewood where bandits / saxons / other raiders might roam.

Also, there is no love for that southern branch of Test River, south of Caer Du Plain. West and East Tytherley would fit nicely south of Buckholt and Broughten respectively, and Lockerly Hall south of Broughten on the river. Of course, these manors may have been destroyed by the saxon attack up the Test River, in 480s, I believe it was. But by 541 AD, they might have been rebuilt?

And finally, south of Pitton, just slightly to the east where the plain meets the edge of the forest and Salisbury's border... Grimstead. Can't go wrong with a name like that!

(Morien adds in the forum: I see Grimstead was added... I think that in comparison to Pitton, it is a bit too far east and north. It is actually closer to that river bank.)

Anyway, just some ideas. :)

Cheers,
Morien


Another forwarded email about Falt:

Re: map...

I would also rename some of your picks (although I understand why you might have to keep Falt, since it is already published):
Falt -> Clarendon (Or Clarendon/Falt, claiming that Clarendon is the name of the village, but since the people living in the Manor are de Falt family, the Manor is usually called Falt Manor, if you reeeeally want to keep Falt).
Clarendon -> Harnham
Harnham -> Bemerton

Those would fit much better location-wise.

Cheers,
Morien

As for where names should appear, I would imagine that if it a real place (as these, from Domesday Book, are) then its actual location is pretty much settled if the place still exists.

Also, take a look at the maps of the Hundreds that is going up too. It might explain why some areas seem devoid of player manors.

Yes, my constructive criticism about the places is based on looking at Google Maps of current villages and comparing them with the villages already placed on the map. For example, Clarendon is on the east bank of Avon, south-east of Laverstock in real world, i.e. where Falt is in the map that was posted. :)

Same with the manor that is now named Clarendon; it sits smack-a-dab on the site of the real world East Harnham.

The manor named Harnham: the location corresponds to the real world Bemerton.

Disclaimer: I haven't even taken a look at the Domesday Book, so no idea if Bemerton is named there.

Let me see if I can link the Google Map image here... OK, didn't work. Here is the link to the map I was looking, though:

http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=51.071605,-1.782188&spn=0.053069,0.117073&t=h&z=13

Note that the current location of Salisbury is SOUTH of Old Sarum (it is that round hillfort just north of town, on the uppermost edge of the map right next to the label of A345).

What an excellent resource.

We just need one of those for each of the other 99 homelands now. *hides*

As for where names should appear, I would imagine that if it a real place (as these, from Domesday Book, are) then its actual location is pretty much settled if the place still exists.

Also, take a look at the maps of the Hundreds that is going up too. It might explain why some areas seem devoid of player manors.


This is now up: www.gspendragon.com/salisburyhundreds.html (http://www.gspendragon.com/salisburyhundreds.html)