The passions need to be renamed and reorganized both to make them easier to say and write and to make them more logical.

PASSIONS
#1 Honor
#2 Hospitality
#3 Vassalage – replaces both Loyalty (Lords).
#4 Fellowship – replaces both Loyalty (Group) and Loyalty (Vassals).
#5 Kinship – replaces love (Family)
#6 Love [Spouse] – love is a character's Resistance Factor when being romanced for Amours.
#7 Hate [Saxons] – replaces Hate (Saxons) and is used for any raids whom normally invade Logres (AKA the Picts and the Scots/Irish).

BASE VASSALAGE
#1 Vassal's Honor = Vassalage modified by:
The Vassal was not trained at the Lord's court -3 (or trained with him as a Squire).
The Vassal is just a Stipendiary (mercenary) -6 [+1/£1 of yearly stipend, max +6].
The Vassal is just an Household Knight -2.
The Vassal is a parvenu -1/generation of his lineage whom did not serve the Lord or his lineage (max. -3).

#2 Roll the Lord's Honor:
Critical +5, the Lord appreciates the Vassal.
Success – no adjustment.
Failure -2, the Lord barely notices the Vassal's service.
Fumble -5, the Lord openly despises the Vassal.

Critical – the Lord gives the Vassal reinforced mail and replaces horses and equipment lost in his service. The Vassal gains +5 to Courtesy skill when dealing with the Lord.
Success – the Lord replaces horses and equipment lost in his service.
Failure – the Lord replaces lost horses and equipment with inferior ones: horses do only d3/d6 damage when charging; shields offer only +3 to armor; swords break like ordinary weapons. -2 to the Vassal's Courtesy skill when dealing with the Lord.
Fumble – the Lord does not replace horses and equipment lost in his service at all, unless he makes a Fellowship roll, then he replaces them only with inferior ones.

#3 Roll the Lord's Fellowship:
Critical +5, the Lord is open handed and treats the Vassal's interests like his own.
Success – no adjustment, the Lord protects the Vassal and considers his interests.
Failure -2, the Lord treats the Vassal as a servant not a comrade and is indifferent to his welfare.
Fumble -5, the Lord openly dislikes the Vassal. He endangers and exploits the Vassal.

Critical - the Lord will pay any ransom the Vassal can't. He will give the Vassal gifts worth £2d3 at his annual feast year (the gifts end when he grants another manor). The Vassal also +5 to all Courtesy skill rolls with the Lord.
Success - he automatically helps the Vassal when impoverished. He gives the Vassal £d3 in any year the has completed a mission for him.
Failure – he only if the Vassal is impoverished gives £d3. The Vassal's Courtesy skill is -2 when dealing with the Lord.
Fumble – he never helps the Vassal nor gives him gifts. The Vassal's Courtesy skill is -5 when dealing with the Lord.

BASE FELLOWSHIP
Vassal's Hospitality = Fellowship modified by:

Roll the Vassal's Hospitality
Critical – the Vassal is popular +5.
Success – the Vassal is accepted, no adjustment.
Failure – the Vassal is tolerated -2
Fumble – the Vassal is an outcast -5.

Loyalty (Lord) or Vassalage: About the name I like the loyalty more as this is the same as for groups and vassals. It is the same kind of passion. As I replied in the other threat I would not link this to honor. Here it is even more relevant to keep them split.

Fellowship: I would want to have the Loyalty(group) and loyalty(vassals) split. Sometimes players even ask that they may split their loyalty between the group members. The height of the loyalty does not have to depend on the PK's hospitality. It can be based on other traits as well. It mostly depends on what the group determines as important traits and passions. It could be even Hate(Saxons) if the group is 'Knights who hate Saxons'.

Loyalty (Lord) or Vassalage: About the name I like the loyalty more as this is the same as for groups and vassals. It is the same kind of passion. As I replied in the other threat I would not link this to honor. Here it is even more relevant to keep them split.

Fellowship: I would want to have the Loyalty(group) and loyalty(vassals) split. Sometimes players even ask that they may split their loyalty between the group members. The height of the loyalty does not have to depend on the PK's hospitality. It can be based on other traits as well. It mostly depends on what the group determines as important traits and passions. It could be even Hate(Saxons) if the group is 'Knights who hate Saxons'.


did you at least like the random adjustments to the vassal's passions based on how his lord and his fellow vassals reacted to him?

PASSIONS
#1 Honor
#2 Hospitality
#3 Vassalage – replaces both Loyalty (Lords).
#4 Fellowship – replaces both Loyalty (Group) and Loyalty (Vassals).
#5 Kinship – replaces love (Family)
#6 Love [Spouse] – love is a character's Resistance Factor when being romanced for Amours.
#7 Hate [Saxons] – replaces Hate (Saxons) and is used for any raids whom normally invade Logres (AKA the Picts and the Scots/Irish).

ok I do not like renaming the passions and her is why
#1 Honor vs Dishonor This can go up or down depending on ones actions the lower honor is the most dishonorable you are and vice verse.
#2 Hospitality applies to any one visting you and requesting hospitality it basically controls how you react to whose asking ad how you receive them later.
#3 I like having Loyalty lords split her is an example of why Bolboris de Gannis is your lord but is a vassel of pendragon so yo have loalty Lord Bolboris de gannis and loyalty lord pendragon, so you have two different rolls to make on which one do you listen too or do you listen to both.
#3 and #4 Vassalage and Fellowship ya could work but again you run into more then one type of Loyalty lord aka several vassalage's and several groups or fellowship I think i would be too confusing.
#5 Five Kinship and love of family are two different ones kin ship to me means all your clan members but love of family means just that your imeudate family Grand father, Grand mother, father, Mother, wife, son, brother or sister ya bad idea to rename them I think.
#7 true love is a woman's reluctance factor but in my campaign and how I perseave the rule love adds to the rf so if you took that away the rf would be lower.
#8 ok last is hate this is the most powerful in the game as you can have a character Hate All Knights or hate Arthur and his knights not just Saxons!


did you at least like the random adjustments to the vassal's passions based on how his lord and his fellow vassals reacted to him? Thier ok I might use them later!

[quote] PASSIONS
#1 Honor
#2 Hospitality
#3 Vassalage – replaces both Loyalty (Lords).
#4 Fellowship – replaces both Loyalty (Group) and Loyalty (Vassals).
#5 Kinship – replaces love (Family)
#6 Love [Spouse] – love is a character's Resistance Factor when being romanced for Amours.
#7 Hate [Saxons] – replaces Hate (Saxons) and is used for any raids whom normally invade Logres (AKA the Picts and the Scots/Irish).

ok I do not like renaming the passions and her is why
#1 Honor vs Dishonor This can go up or down depending on ones actions the lower honor is the most dishonorable you are and vice verse.
#2 Hospitality applies to any one visting you and requesting hospitality it basically controls how you react to whose asking ad how you receive them later.
#3 I like having Loyalty lords split her is an example of why Bolboris de Gannis is your lord but is a vassel of pendragon so yo have loalty Lord Bolboris de gannis and loyalty lord pendragon, so you have two different rolls to make on which one do you listen too or do you listen to both.
#3 and #4 Vassalage and Fellowship ya could work but again you run into more then one type of Loyalty lord aka several vassalage's and several groups or fellowship I think i would be too confusing.
#5 Five Kinship and love of family are two different ones kin ship to me means all your clan members but love of family means just that your imeudate family Grand father, Grand mother, father, Mother, wife, son, brother or sister ya bad idea to rename them I think.
#7 true love is a woman's reluctance factor but in my campaign and how I perseave the rule love adds to the rf so if you took that away the rf would be lower.
#8 ok last is hate this is the most powerful in the game as you can have a character Hate All Knights or hate Arthur and his knights not just Saxons!



did you at least like the random adjustments to the vassal's passions based on how his lord and his fellow vassals reacted to him? Thier ok I might use them later!

Loyalty (Lord) or Vassalage: About the name I like the loyalty more as this is the same as for groups and vassals. It is the same kind of passion. As I replied in the other threat I would not link this to honor. Here it is even more relevant to keep them split.

Fellowship: I would want to have the Loyalty(group) and loyalty(vassals) split. Sometimes players even ask that they may split their loyalty between the group members. The height of the loyalty does not have to depend on the PK's hospitality. It can be based on other traits as well. It mostly depends on what the group determines as important traits and passions. It could be even Hate(Saxons) if the group is 'Knights who hate Saxons'.


did you at least like the random adjustments to the vassal's passions based on how his lord and his fellow vassals reacted to him?

I think the ground of the loyalty is the way the knighting is done. Of course if you are not part of the household of the lord aka becoming a mercenary means that the loyalty should be lower. When hired by a lord (not the lord who knighted him) I would let his loyalty be determined by his honor. He is not just a common merc, but a knight. So I would think his word is more important than the pay. So the -6 penalty for being knighted and becoming a mercenary I would use, but not the increase in payment I woul leave out.

The being originally not part of the court of the lord would in my opinion not have much effect on the loyalty. But maybe the other way around it would. Having grown up in the court of the lord may make a person more loyal?

On the other hand it may depend more on the way the PK and the lord think (aka do they have high traits in common?) or how he treats his vassals (aka loyalty (vassals)). A lord that treats his vassals poorly would mean the loyalty of the vassals is less high. Not sure if it should be a roll.

Honor of the lord also may determine the height of the loyalty, but as I said in other threats I like the idea that the passions are in conflict. A lord with a low honor and a high loyalty vassals would not lower the loyalty of his vassals. they know he is an honorless scum, but he treats them well so they do not have any complaints. Of course this differs if the PK himself has a high honor, but that will only add to the drama.

IMG When a PK receives a new loyalty I mostly let the player decide without rolling. In most cases they determine the height of the loyalty in comparison to his other passions. What I do is question the player how his character feels about it. This way we discuss the height of the loyalty and usually come to an agreement on the height. In this case I do not allow passions to be higher than 15. I do this especially if the loyalty is the loyalty (group).

As for the equipment and ransom. I would let that determine only when appropriate. So this is more in play than determined at the moment of knighting.
So a critical honor or loyalty(vassals) roll at the moment of knighting may make the lord give a gift of equipment to the new knight. But usually the knights equipment is provided by his family.
Paying the ransom I would determine when the need arises. Again usually the family pays first, but a generous lord may add to the ransom. Of course if the lord does nothing I would allow the PK to lower his loyalty.